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2005/10/30, 05:56 PM
so i am begining a new training routine and i am trying wrestlers idea of doing mostly compound lifts anyway... i need some help so if you all could please tear it apart and make it better that would be awesome. thanks.
my split is 1:chest/shoulder/tri/bi
2:legs/back/trap/abs
anyway:
Mon: decline press (db)
flat bench (bb)
incline press (db)
close grip presses
weighted dips
SHOULDER (i have no idea what good combo's would be... was thinking maybe just db press (arnold) or perhaps doing clean and press? any ideas would be cool)
rows (not sure what kind)
pullups or chinups (which would be better?)
tue: off (have intramural sports like flag football/volleyball/softball/soccer)
Wed: Box squat
leg curls
leg press
calf raises
deadlift
hyperextension
(more back stuff?)
shrugs (db or bb?)
upright chin press
ab work.
thu (monday routine
fri (wed again?) i guess i could just try and do it on weekends but i know that i wont be able to make it so i think fri is my best bet.
What do you all think? Any and all help is very much appreciated and i respect all of your replies... thank you very much.
-Nate
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2005/10/30, 08:15 PM
I like that you included traps with your lower body. This is what I do, because I get my best trap workout from deadlifts and powercleans.
I might advise seperating upper back/lats, and lower back though.
I might alternate pushing and pulling exercise though. Your doing 4 sets of pushing exercise in a row. Try this:
Start of with BB bench press. It is very effective, and should be first. Then, follow that up with pull ups, another very effective upper boy exercise. This will give your tri's a couple sets to recover before you move onto decline, incline, or DB bench. I would remove one of them. I think that when you try that, you will realize why. No need to have your back up against a bench for that much of your workout.
AS for your leg day, I would put deadlift ahead of leg curls and leg presses. I am not a big fan of the leg press either. I know it does have its advantages, but I am sure someone else will say it if I don't.
I would seperate DL and Squat. Perhaps Squat on wed, and then DL on friday. If you do do DL on the same day as squat, either do speed dl's, or a few sets of singles. I do powercleans or snatches instead of speed dl's, and this is also my trap workout.
I was under the impression that the chin press was an ashtanga yoga pose???
I think friday would be best moved to sat or sun, but if you will have trouble committing, leave it how it is.
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The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over. ~~~Hunter S. Thompson
If you smoke or don’t wear your seatbelt, please don’t tell me the deadlift is dangerous.
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2005/10/30, 08:17 PM
also, I know I directed you to the westside site... What did you think??? Is this where you got the idea to include box squats? I would say that if you have trouble progressing on this plan, westside might be a viable option for you. I am yet to find someone that didn't benefit from westside.
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The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over. ~~~Hunter S. Thompson
If you smoke or don’t wear your seatbelt, please don’t tell me the deadlift is dangerous.
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2005/10/30, 11:21 PM
you didnt give me the website... but i would definetly like to take a look at... ive heard a lot about it but havent really looked into it. and no, i used to do reg squats and then tried out overhead and front squats... and didnt find that i could hold enough weight to give my legs a workout. and then i have been playin a lot of football so i kind of felt that box squats would build up some explosiveness. i like the idea of sittin with the weight to relieve all pressure on the legs and then powerin off the box.. just sounds effective to me. what would you suggest- do upper and lower back on the same day? also, i thought upright chin press was the stuff for the traps that is when you pull the bar up to your chin... not sure though. so im assuming you recommend somesort of cleans or something for me? and when do i do that... cant figure out good shoulder idea. and should i use maybe preacher curls for more bicep? i would really like to move my friday... but i feel as if i do then i will be much more succeptable to doin something else... whereas i have trained myself to go durin week.
thanks
nate
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2005/10/30, 11:25 PM
westside-barbell.com
elitefts.com
As for the overhead and front squat, you will go up quickly in weight as your technique gets better, and you will find you are working your legs differently. When people ask me what I do for ab work, I say full contact twists and overhead squats, because they are one of the best movements for abdominals
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The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over. ~~~Hunter S. Thompson
If you smoke or don’t wear your seatbelt, please don’t tell me the deadlift is dangerous.
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2005/10/30, 11:38 PM
yea... well i think i am goin to try out the box squats for a while... see how i like them. what do you think for shoulders?
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2005/10/30, 11:40 PM
im tryin to finalize all my stuff so i can start this new routine tommorrow. i still dont know what for shoulders, or biceps and if/when to put cleans and press in...
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2005/10/30, 11:47 PM
stick with the basics. I do alot of shoulder work, but this is mostly for pre-habilitation. I have alot of shoulder problems. I focus on the overhead squat, overhead press (db and bb) and the clean and jerk, or push press.
Put clean and press wherever. I put my cleans and snatches in on DE squat/deadlift day. This is because I view my cleans as a form of speed dl.
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The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over. ~~~Hunter S. Thompson
If you smoke or don’t wear your seatbelt, please don’t tell me the deadlift is dangerous.
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2005/10/31, 12:08 AM
can you point me to some good article examples on those sites.. thats a lot of readin haha. i want to see an example of a schedule. also, what do you know about doin things for rib cage expansion? i want to expand but i am curious bout this. thanks for your help wrestler... people like you make me really love this board.
-nate
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2005/10/31, 12:40 PM
bump for awesome question nate! you sure are cool... haha anyone else have opinions on the matter? and perhaps what is a good article to look at so i can understand westside. on either of those sites of course
nate
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2005/10/31, 01:46 PM
the template is a sticky in this forum. However, if you dont want to bother with "a lot of readin" then I would stick with what you have. The only way to not benefit from westside is to do it wrong. Either take the time to learn and do it right, or stick with what you have. Theres alot of good infomation on those sites.
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The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over. ~~~Hunter S. Thompson
If you smoke or don’t wear your seatbelt, please don’t tell me the deadlift is dangerous.
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2005/10/31, 02:27 PM
yea...but when i was looking on that site all i could find was stuff about guys coming from other places in the world to try out westside. i could not find anything that actually explained it in detail. i was hopin you could provide me with a specific article, and then if i find that interesting i can continue to read more information from there. but i dont have the time to read about some guy from some place trying it out and how well he did.
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2005/10/31, 02:37 PM
on another note.... i think i should probably take the next week off because i tried out a general format for my routine today.. and not only was it extremely time consuming, but it taxed my energy so much i was not able to finish. i know i really need to drop out and rearrange some exercises, but i dont know which ones. not only that but i think i messed up my shoulder when i was benching and the bar came more towards my neck than to the center of my chest-i think that was why i did sooooo poorly on my bench work.
here we go: (weight*reps)
bench press-155*8,175*1*1*1,165*2,135*6
(i think i messed my shoulder up on the first rep of 1 175 cuz i couldnt get anywhere with reps at any weight up after that)
chin ups-0*10*10*6 pullups-0*6 (i didnt know which one i should do)
decline press-70*6*5*6
incline 60*6*6
rows-160*7*7*7
clean and press 95*2*1,75*2
close grip- 70+smith machine bar*8
and thats where i stopped... my body basically gave up after the failed attempts on clean and press. i still had overhead press(db), dips, and preacher curls planned. what i did get done took me an hour but i didnt get in full sets and i didnt get all the lift in. so obviously i need to move stuff to another day or do something different.... that was just way to strenuous today. and i think i need to do chest specialization or something cuz i think all my other numbers are decent and i have steady growth... but my chest lifts never grow.. i feel like i am always stuck. thanks for reading this far if you did, and i really appreciate all the help i can get. but as for now i guess i am goin to take the week off and maybe see if i can get some motivation back... this kinda hurt my morale today
-nate
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2005/10/31, 02:40 PM
oh... and thanks for pointin me at the template.. i feel like an idiot hahahaha. at least i will have a week to learn more about it and adjust my plan.
thanks wrestler
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2005/10/31, 07:10 PM
I can tell you why you crashed. Your doing 5 exerciss for pressing alone, and were planning dips and overhead press... Thats more exercises than I do all together in one day.
When you're doing compound movements, you dont need to do as many of them, because you get the carryover from each exercise. Cut back. Way back.
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The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over. ~~~Hunter S. Thompson
If you smoke or don’t wear your seatbelt, please don’t tell me the deadlift is dangerous.
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2005/10/31, 07:55 PM
ok cool... i think i am actually gonna try the modified westside you were telling me about, the only reason i said weakness exercises is cuz that is what gator has on the template. thanks,
nate
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2005/10/31, 08:35 PM
Cutting back is good sound advice. I started to train for the 3 main lifts a few months ago. I also however did all the otehr exercises for each and every body part. Soon I had small nagging injuries. What I did is to focus on the 3 lifts (bench, deadlifts, squats) and add in just a few sets of tri and shoulders. I also do hamstring work once a week or so. That is it. Not only have I seen better weights on the 3 lifts. But my body i snot killing me now. Good luck!
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Less Talk, More Chalk!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2005/11/02, 08:19 PM
hey... i was thinkin bout the westside program.. and i dont know what is the most effectient way to record my results. right now i have a chart that has like 15 rows and 30 columns or so... but obviously since i would be changin my lifts every 2-3weeks then i would run out of room... how do you record that you would recommend. if this is a stupid question just let me know...
nate
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2005/11/03, 12:26 AM
It has a simple answer, but it is by no means a stupid question...
Keep a workout log. Record everything. You should be doing this no matter what program you are on.
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The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over. ~~~Hunter S. Thompson
If you smoke or don’t wear your seatbelt, please don’t tell me the deadlift is dangerous.
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2005/11/03, 11:48 AM
yea.. but im saying what is the most effectient way to record it. like... obviously right now i am doin the same lift on the same days and in the same order. but if i do westside, i will constantly be changing my lifts... so therefor i cant really have a nice chart or anything because i will constantly be adding, i was just tryin to find out what worked best... guess good ol' college bound paper is good... ill just write what im doin each and every time. i dont even think this makes sense to anyone. oh... and wrestler, can you respond to one of the messages i sent you with the lifts i wanted to do... cuz haha i forgot to write them down and just wrote that while i was writin to you and know i dont know what i was going to do...
-nate
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2005/11/03, 12:22 PM
and i am saying keep a complete workout log. With every lift you do, not just your PR's.
A workout log is more like a journal. You record all the lifts you do. Menace and Mike keep them on here on threads if you want to see what they look like. Then, when you want to know what kind of weight you should be doing, you just look at your past weeks. This way, you also keep track of how you progress, and how your body reacts to certain types of training stimuli.
Also, I'm pretty sure I responded to them all, but I will check my inbox.
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The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over. ~~~Hunter S. Thompson
If you smoke or don’t wear your seatbelt, please don’t tell me the deadlift is dangerous.
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2006/01/25, 07:02 PM
i need a good beginner routine
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