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2006/04/09, 01:46 PM
Ok, so I've been doing some conjugated periodization of ME and Repetition days to add some size and boost my strength. I am going to rest and rehab my hip until my max out day for my legs. I was just curious, should I do some dynamic work on my last upper body repetition day to get a better max-out? To be honest, I'm not that concerned with my leg max-outs. Of course I want to do well, but it's not likely considering the injuries and time off. Anyways, I was just curious about the dynamic stuff, but anything you think would help me with my max-out is much more than welcome. Thanks
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/09, 02:31 PM
While the DE Work will be easy on the muscles, it will tax your central nervous system. You want your cns to be fully recovered to find a test max, and while you may feel recovered physically, this does not mean your CNS is 100%.
I would not recommend it. This is not to say you should not do it. Only that I would rather err on the side of caution.
However, some perform better when they have had their hands on heavy weight or done DE leading up to contest.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/04/09, 05:20 PM
I just wasn't sure because I thought that was the whole point of doing the DE 2 days before ME work, was because it improved your heavy lifting?
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/09, 06:47 PM
You can try doing a few light warm up sets...then working up to 125% 1rm walkouts.....for 10 sec then....maybe even 1/8 squat.....then rerack...rest 3-5 minutes....and go for your target 100% 1rm....
I would get a mouthpiece as rev suggested....and clench hard on the mouthpiece
I would also take 200-400mg caffeine pill+ 81-325mg of aspirin.....may give u a good boost....
I would also take a B-complex for a week leading up to the ME...
creatine?
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2006/04/09, 08:05 PM
I only use a mouthpiece when deadlifting. I think it takes away from my focus in other lifts.
Although I need a new one. After my 405 at the stronger than all it was practically bit in half.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/04/09, 08:42 PM
Wrestler have you run across any articles that show relationship between intraabdominal pressure and 1rm or lifting in general...?
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2006/04/09, 11:25 PM
articles or studies?
Lots of articles. Louie Simmons mentions it a lot, Siff writes about it, every russian author I have read mentions it. Dave Tate routinely talks about how it was Louie teaching him to use a belt to train IAP to blow away his squat in a contest as changing his life.
For the most part, I think it falls under the category of one of those "under the bar" tips, although it is fairly common in literature.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/04/10, 02:12 AM
What about holding breath or clenching jaw during maximal attempts to increase IAP?....don't necessarily understand the need of a belt ...it's essentially a mnemonic device....
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2006/04/10, 06:40 PM
B-Complex? And since you suggested walkouts, should I unrack a heavier weight as well on the Bench Press?
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/11, 12:19 AM
A belt is a device to teach you how to use your abdominals. It should be worn one notch to lose, then the abdomen should be filled with air and braced AGAINST the belt.
I don't use one. And the only time I can really focus on IAP is with powerlifting squats.
As for holding breath, if you are TRYING to force air out, then it will just cause your diaphragm to contract similarly to a forced exhalation, which increases IAP.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Display&dopt=pubmed_pubmed&from_uid=16333683
Not many studies involving powerlifters, or people squatting, as its a fairly difficult thing to measure or study.
Any good weightlifting coach will teach the same. I know it works from experiance. Using a losse belt I can generally add weight to anyones squat and make them feel more stable. Take it or leave it.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/04/11, 04:14 AM
B-Complex should help your CNS recover...
Unracking heavy weight on bench works similarly....
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2006/04/12, 12:11 AM
i have a question about Defranco, sinc you are on that... for maxing.. since he recommends obtaining a 3 or 5rm, what do you do for the sets before that. on WS, you just did sets of 3 till form comprimised and then did your 1... if im goin for a 3rm on squats... what am i supposed to do for sets leadin up to that.
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2006/04/12, 12:43 PM
Well you should already know about what it will be. Do a warm up, and hit a set that is 10% under your estimated max. Rest 5 minutes between sets, and work from there.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/04/12, 08:09 PM
Natedawg, it's not too hard. I did close grip bench, and on my last set, I "broke the rules" and went for a 1RM. I'm not completely sure but I think my ME routine was something like this.
Bar x10
95 x5
115 x5
125 x5
135 x5
135 x5
145 x2
145 x1
I started out real light and did as many sets as I needed to warm up, but I didn't do too many and get all hypertrophied before my heavier weight using a range of 55 pounds. After the set with 135, I got kinda tired,and the last 1 rep with 145 barely made it. I probably didn't rest long enough between sets though (probably 2 or so). Wrestler's recommendation sounds good though... Alot of it depends on you. In DeFranco's program, he tells to to focus more on hypertrophy to build muscle. That's why he recommends the 3-5 rep max. I'm still doing the repetition days but personally, I felt like goin for the strength yesterday more than the hypertrophy.
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/12, 08:11 PM
Not that it matters, but I didn't want to look like an idiot. The range I used was obviously 50 pounds not counting the bar. Not 55. :laugh:
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/12, 09:35 PM
Aron I feel you're sacrificing too much strength doing so many warm up sets...I bet you're sacrificing a good 10-20 lb doing it this way...
try
95 for 10
115 for 3
135 for 1
145 for 1
150-155 for 1
160-165 for 1
rest at least 5 minutes between sets 145 onward.....I highly suggest you try caffeine+aspirin stack as it will give you a significant boost....
You're using working weight for 'warm up' sets....you're literally robbing yourself of strength....and those are too many sets....I can understand someone wanting many sets to build to a very large number....so that they don't jump a lot of pounds from set to set....going for PR....but your max out was 145.....so if you wanted more warm up sets then you would do
45(bar):10-20
65:10
85:5
105:3
125:1
145:1
etc.....assuming you use 20 lb progressions.....
Also before the 'target' weight...I suggest unracking 105-125% and holding it outstretched for 10sec....then reracking, resting 3-5 minutes and doing the target 1 rep max.....so in your case I would use something like 185
good luck man
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2006/04/13, 01:31 AM
Thanks. The thing is, I was just trying to do the sets of 3-5 and then at the end decided on the 1RM, so it ended up kinda messed up. But next time I'm gonna try that. I'm really lookin forward to tryin the heavy 100%+ unracking because I think that would help me a lot.
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/13, 01:33 AM
When I was training for the storngman competitions, I did walkouts with as much as 465 on my back. Now when I squat, 265 goes ATG no problem now. I was also pulling from a rack, and pulled a 405 in competition. Some people just respond best to having heavy weight in their hands.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/04/13, 10:12 AM
What's ATG?
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/13, 04:48 PM
Ass to grass. Full range deep olympic squat.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/04/13, 07:48 PM
wow.. you are doing a great job of progressing wrestler. you pulled 405? thats such a big difference between your ATG. I tried but missed 315 ATG the other day. and i cant hit 315 dl... i think i am built weird or something...haha.
and yea baller.. i think if you are pyramiding your weight up like that you need to have bigger gaps in between. you are only upping 10lbs... try starting lower and adding more on... like go up 20 lbs or so each time... (i think that is good... its WS recommendation)
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2006/04/13, 10:10 PM
I have really screwed up hips. Like, horribly screwed up hips. Thats why I don't squat near what I pull. I'm undergoing therapy at the moment, and it is helping a lot. I hope to be hitting much heavier weight if all goes as planned.
For the first time I can squat down without pain. It used to take me at least 185 on my back before I could even drop into the hole effectively, and even then I had some serious pelvic tilt.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/04/13, 10:12 PM
Steve, how'd you screw your hips up? I'm currently tryin to figure out what's wrong with my right one. I fell and it hyperextended outwards bigtime. I have the pain and effects that most ppl have when they've got torn ligaments, but the Arthrogram/MRI came back negative. Doc said it's some kinda tendonitis, but I don't know about that. It's been hurtin for 6 months.
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/13, 10:46 PM
Well to start with ive hyperextended both my knees.
I have tight hip flexors, glutes, adductors, a damaged IT band, I recently tore my rectus femurus, tight hamstrings, poorly activated glutes, scar tissue build up all over my upper hip (all over) and adhesion at the knees, as well as hip tendonitis. Really poor mobility is the result.
Im having ART done once a week, as well as mobility work and my own prehab type stuff. My adductors are weak and tight, so thats a major area of concern, and is one of the things keeping me from squatting big numbers. The ART should help a lot. I have the advantage of knowing everything a physical therapist will do so I can do it on my own so as to afford the ART work.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/04/14, 12:27 AM
http://customnutritionwarehouse.com/product_info.php?products_id=1043
should help with tendinitis...give it a few weeks...night and day...
I like to use it twice a day ....put 1/4-1/2 teaspoon in the mouth.....swish a bit of water...and bam......should work well together with G/C+Fish Oil....
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2006/04/14, 01:31 AM
Your hip tendonitis, what pain does it cause you? Does hip flexion, extension, adduction, or abduction hurt as result of the tendonitis? Cuz none of that stuff bothers my hip THAT bad. Though it does get extremely sore after exercise or sitting down for a long time. Here's what bothers me the most: Whenever I sit down or lay down, and I point my knee outward (perform abduction), it absolutely kills me, but not when I'm standing up. Sound like tendonitis to you? Plus, I've been doing rehab exercises and taking Cissus off and on for about 6 months. You would think it would have calmed down by now?
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/14, 01:33 AM
I have all the symptoms of a acetabular labrum tear, but the MRI showed nothing of the sort. Maybe it's strained, I dunno but I think there's somethin wrong with it. I'm thinkin about consulting a different doctor.
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/14, 02:29 AM
how much cissus did u take and how long? also how long did u give ur hip to heal? (without training/over exertion of any kind....lifting, bball, etc)....perhaps time off is the only thing that will work...
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2006/04/14, 10:04 AM
Well, I first injured it right before my bball season started (talk about gettin screwed), and I took probably 2-3 weeks completely off and did my rehab. I don't really remember if I was taking Cissus at this particular time, but I have been taking it off and on for a while now because I've gone through 3 bottles or so. Usually, I take Cissus faithfully for a few weeks at a time, and I take Cissus RX from USP Labs, not just the straight powder. The thing is, I've been doin stuff with my achilles and the Cissus seems to help take care of it, but nothing happens to the hip. This is why I wonder if it's really tendonitis.
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/14, 12:19 PM
Sounds like a hip flexor tear by the description. Honestly, doesn't sound much like tendonitis to me.
I'm not a doctor, so I would rather not say anything other than that.
Abduction hurts, and I have extremely tight adductors. Its getting better already with therapy, now that I have worked out some of the scar tissue I can actually get something out of my stretching.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/04/15, 09:36 AM
I don't really know if it is my hip flexor because it doesn't really hurt to perform hip flexion. It hurts turning my hip outward sitting down or laying down. Really, anytime my hip is abductively forced is when it really kills me because that's how it got injured in the first place. Like during a game one time this big man on the other team was diving for the ball and he just jumped straight into my hip causing it to forcefully abduct...I had to sit out a practice or two after that one. It also hurts pretty bad when I stand up after sitting down for a little while.
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/15, 12:55 PM
Doesn't have to. I tore my hip flexor clear off the joint and it only hurt when I went from a seated position to trying to stand up. I would find a specialist.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/04/15, 03:03 PM
Wow I didn't know that. So what kind of specialist should I see or be looking for? The Doc I went and saw was an orthopedic doctor.
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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2006/04/21, 03:58 PM
Here is what I do. I warm-up properly. Then I perform sets of 2 until I feel they are starting to challenge me. I jump 20 lbs on these. Then I start doing singles. Jumping 10-20 lbs depending on what the single feels like. Bigger jumps early. Smaller jumps as I get closer to a true max. Proper spots on bench and squat are essential. Make sure when you max out your mind is right. Focus on what you are doing. 1 lapse of focus and you can get seriously hurt.
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2006/04/21, 10:55 PM
Thanks Matt, and it is so awesome to have you back man. So if I were to unrack the heavier weight and hold it out there for about 10 seconds (like you suggested, Menace), should I rest a minute or two after that, or should I try for a weight right away?
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I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
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