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2006/06/28, 08:26 PM
Hey everyone...
In your opinion, what is the best 3-day split for weight training? Obviously (?), legs would have to be paired with a muscle... so which would be the best?
Would Monday: chest, bi's
Wednesday: legs, back
Friday: shoulders, tri's
be good?
Any other suggestions?
Thanks
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2006/06/28, 11:26 PM
I think working the legs and back on the same day might be much... both big muscle groups...
Maybe:
Chest/Bis
Legs/Shoulders
Back/Tris
Maybe wrestler will chime in here with some thoughts?
t
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I am training for birthdays.
Be here. Live. Love. Hope. Now. Faith. Believe. You. - Keith Urban
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2006/06/29, 10:50 AM
I like tim's suggestion to tell you the truth for most normal lifting routines.
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Less Talk, More Chalk!
The Men and Boys are Separated by one thing: The Squat Cage!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/06/29, 02:22 PM
I know workout split has been discussed a million times and it varies what works best from person to person, but why do you, tim, mutt, or anybody, adhere to a certian split. I'm not trying to get a total body training vs. split debate, just what's your split, if you use one, and why.
I do:
Back/Biceps/Abs
Chest/Triceps
Shoulders/Legs/Abs
because most chest exercises work triceps, too, so it seems like putting triceps on a different day would be overtraining. Obviously, I am most likely wrong here, but that's why I wanted to get this discussion going. I apologize if this has been done already. There's alot of threads about split, but I didn't see one where people just say what they do and why.
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2006/06/29, 02:27 PM
For the most part it is a number of reasons, like vs dislike, time constraints, goals, etc. I use a powerlifting routine based on WestSide training which is way different than a regualr split. I like you split Matt it is what I used a lot of when I was just starting out. Some splits are better than others in terms of getting to a goal, but there really is not concrete golden Split to end all Splits.
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Less Talk, More Chalk!
The Men and Boys are Separated by one thing: The Squat Cage!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/06/29, 02:45 PM
OK, I don't want to hound you, mutt. . .HAHAHAHAHA
But, why do you say you like Tim's split for normal lifting routines?
If it's just like/dislike, that's cool, I just want to know.
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2006/06/29, 02:53 PM
Because back is on a differnt day than legs
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Less Talk, More Chalk!
The Men and Boys are Separated by one thing: The Squat Cage!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/06/29, 03:02 PM
I've done legs and back on the same day before and am completely beat when it's done.. not that that's a bad thing, I just think once you've spent a big amount of energy on a big muscle group, you may not have any gas in the tank for the next big one.
t
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I am training for birthdays.
Be here. Live. Love. Hope. Now. Faith. Believe. You. - Keith Urban
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2006/06/29, 03:02 PM
OK, thanks.
Anybody else want to play "What's your split and why?"
I heard Clint Eastwood is on a 2 day split of only grip training and forearms. That's how he can spin them pistols.
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2006/06/29, 03:16 PM
I use a three day split of
chest, shoulders, tris
back, bis
legs
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2006/06/29, 04:52 PM
currently personal train has me on this...
Legs
Chest, Tris, Abs
Back, bis
Shoulders, Legs, Abs
Arms...depending if i have a free day. Figure if i work them hard enough midweek on the big exercises then i dont need a separate arm day.
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If in doubt K.I.S.S.
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2006/06/30, 11:09 PM
My thoughts on the original post...
Whats wrong with training legs and back on the same day? Give me a lower back exercise that doesn't invlove the hamstrings, or a leg exercise that doesn't involve the back.
As for training chest and bi's, or back and tri's. this makes no sense... All of your biggest chest exercises are tricep dominant. All your best upper back exercises include a significant amount of bicep involvement.
Personally, I am yet to find a natural trainer that responded better to a bodypart split than another form of training.
Here are my thoughts...
Bodypart splits are based on a false conception that muscles work in isolation. If anyone here can so much as pick a pencil off of the ground while only using one muscle, then I will never give exercise advice again. The body is a single unit, and it is meant to act as a whole. Why then, would you want to attempt to train your muscles to work independent of each other?
I like to compare body part splits to isolation exercises. If you are doing a bicep day, and focus on bicep isolation exercises, the only thing left is curls. Your best bicep exercises (rows, chins) will be reserved for back day. However, you won't be able to do them on back day, because they are also a bicep exercise. Therefor, you are reduced to exercises like curls. The best exercises involve lots of muscle groups working as a whole, so it stands to reason that the best split would be one that works muscles together.
If you look at the top athletes in any class, they are training each muscle at least 3 times a week. 90% of your recovery happens in the first 24 hours, so why would you wait 168 hours before training that muscle again? If you hit it 3 times a week, even if with less volume, are you not going to grow at least twice as much?
Similarly, I also like to study what other countries are doing. Only in america is the body part split such an epidemic. Russian powerlifters follow total body training splits. Bulgarian olympic lifters train 6 days a week, 2x a day, total body. These are the top strength individuals in the world. And I urge you to find me one top successful strongman in IFSA or WSM (thats a laugh) that preaches breaking up the body parts.
Also, do the research. Find me a single reference to a body part split prior to the popularization of steroids. This is no coincidence. Geared lifters found they could destroy their bodies with massive amounts of volume and still recover well. And the most effective way to get such a massive amount of volume in? A body part split.
Filthy... Your signatures says to keep it simple, right? Then why are you splitting 4 different ways?
I feel everything has its place. But I just don't see why people (americans) are so stuck on splitting everything up. Whats the big deal, is there something I'm missing?
Personally, I think 90% of trainees will do better with an upper/lower split or total body.
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Iron and chalk.
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Quoting from bisleri:
I have heard that working chest and tricep on the same day leads to size reduction of the arms. Is it true.
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2006/07/01, 12:34 AM
Just read a very similar point of view in Men's Health magaize...
Thanks, wrestler!
t
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I am training for birthdays.
Be here. Live. Love. Hope. Now. Faith. Believe. You. - Keith Urban
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2006/07/03, 07:54 AM
For the most part I agree with you as my routine now is no way near a body part split. I feel that a true beginner needs to work thru/up to making that decision. As I said here already there is literally no way that I can do a full body routine to my satisfaction. It would just take way to long. THat is why I advocate a split. It allows people to get in the gym workout then get out with out spending 2 hours in there. I know I know you can do a full bosy routine in a hour yada yada....LOL I can not! LOL
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Less Talk, More Chalk!
The Men and Boys are Separated by one thing: The Squat Cage!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/07/03, 06:31 PM
So then that is why I said total body, OR an upper/lower split, which is what you follow if I'm not mistaken Scott.
Also, something about what you said intrigues me. You say "do a full body routine to my satisfaction." Are you judging your satisfaction by how you feel at the end of the workout?
If so, then there are two points to consider... One, while you may not feel a "pump" in any particular body part, or feel any accumulated fatigue, overall fatigue from doing 3 big compound exercises total body will usually be much greater than 1 compound followed by accessory.
Also, while doing tbt, the purpose is not to destroy your body... Since the frequency is so much higher, the volume can be much less per workout.
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Iron and chalk.
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Quoting from bisleri:
I have heard that working chest and tricep on the same day leads to size reduction of the arms. Is it true.
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2006/07/05, 07:52 AM
I just do not feel worked out after a tbt compared to what I am doing now. Plus when doing tbt I tend to get more tendonitist in my foremarms for some reason.
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Less Talk, More Chalk!
The Men and Boys are Separated by one thing: The Squat Cage!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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