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2006/06/01, 03:51 PM
I have seen people doing this exercise. They get on a flat bench and put there feet flat on the bench and do the bench press.
My question, what is the purpose of this?
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2006/06/01, 04:25 PM
I do them this way as it helps me keep my form better and back flat. I also found it awkward with my feet touching the floor.
t
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I am training for birthdays.
Be here. Live. Love. Hope. Now. Faith. Believe. You. - Keith Urban
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2006/06/01, 06:10 PM
Unfortunately this is one of those things that is seen all over. A arch in the lower back is actualy a good thing. Keeping yopu feet on the bench actualy can cause a injury as it unbalance you and makes it hader to stablize the weight.
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Less Talk, More Chalk!
The Men and Boys are Separated by one thing: The Squat Cage!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/06/01, 06:15 PM
What if you have short legs?
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I am training for birthdays.
Be here. Live. Love. Hope. Now. Faith. Believe. You. - Keith Urban
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2006/06/01, 06:20 PM
Get blocks.
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Days go by and life drags on.....
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2006/06/01, 06:25 PM
hahaha...
I actually don't put my legs on the bench... I place them on a chair at the end of the bench...
Perhaps I'll give it a go without next week...
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I am training for birthdays.
Be here. Live. Love. Hope. Now. Faith. Believe. You. - Keith Urban
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2006/06/01, 09:24 PM
Then put them under your hips. By under, I mean get enough of an arch and bend your legs so that your feet are under your ass on the ground.
While I usually think it is queer, I'll give you as unbiased a review as I can.
Here are the pros and cons:
Pros:
Supposedly better isolation of the pectorals.
Trains "balance".
Less likely to cheat.
Cons:
Why would you want to isolate if training for strength?
Tougher on the shoulders.
Lighter weight = less activation.
Unstable.
Sense of balance can not be trained after puberty, only specific coordination.
Poor lateral and rear deltoid activation.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/06/01, 11:11 PM
I'll give it a go next time I do the bench... I suppose it boils down to preference?
Which way do you do it wrestler?
t
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I am training for birthdays.
Be here. Live. Love. Hope. Now. Faith. Believe. You. - Keith Urban
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2006/06/02, 06:04 AM
yea people think they are 'isolating the core'...however that's retarded IMO...no offense Tim....drives me nuts when I see people do this...
Block/mats work ...and I bet if u tuck your legs underneath you and use an arch you'll have the perfect set up....you sound like you have a good built for bench....take a wider grip and pause each rep if u want great chest workout....if u want good workout...then u'll get it from the increase weight u'll be using....
I think pecs get less stimulation with legs in the air/on bench since you have to use considerably less weight....
Higher chance of injury(due to big decrease in stability)...combine that with frequent muscle imbalances people have and other poor technique variables(people lifting bar unevenly, one side stronger,etc) and it's a recipe for an accident...
If you want to train your 'core' more effectively then do squats, deadlifts, etc....or direct heavy ab, oblique, etc work....dont pick a big movement and effeminate it to the point of unrecognizability....almost as funny/sad as the 1/4 squats by big guys with 5-10lb plates on the bar at my gym....
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2006/06/02, 06:05 AM
if u want good *core* workout...then u'll get it from the increased* weight u'll be using....
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2006/06/02, 08:04 AM
Thanks guys.
t
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I am training for birthdays.
Be here. Live. Love. Hope. Now. Faith. Believe. You. - Keith Urban
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2006/06/02, 03:22 PM
I do it by first standing at mid point of the bar. I then go into a back arch and duck under the bar. I look kinda like a gymnast at this point. I get situated under the bar, then pull my elbows to my sides, and pull my lats together behind my as tight as I can. I slide under the bar, making sure to keep my chest out and my lats together, while keeping my lower back tight as well. I recieve the bar, breath into my stomach, and start lowering (bringing my elbows in at 45 degrees to my side) as I tense my hamstrings and glutes. As soon as the I start bringing the bar to my chest, I tense my abdominals and press, using a valsava manuevere (forced exhalation while tightening the throat at the voice box to increase intra-abdominal pressure).
In short, like a powerlifter.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/06/02, 03:26 PM
I like this article by Sebastian Burns of metal militia.
http://metalmilitia.net/index_files/Page392.htm
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/06/04, 06:13 PM
I put feet on bench somtimes...usually when I close grip press.
Arching your back heavly all the time will put stress on the disks. Its a nice change to give the lower back a rest.
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/04, 11:07 PM
I feel less stress on my back witha big arch and that's when I am most stable....you are more likely to tweak something with legs on bench or in the air...but to each their own..
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2006/06/07, 12:34 PM
You'll only "tweak" somthing....if you doing too much weight.
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/07, 12:36 PM
don't take my word for it...
By: Doug Daniels
Every lifter is in search of the best assistance exercises to help keep those gains coming on the 3 powerlifts. I've found that a great assistance move for the bench is the 'feet off the floor’ variation. Very simply described, this variation is just like the regular bench except that your back is flat with your feet off the ground and above the bench with the ankles crossed.
This variation accomplishes several things. It isolates the upper body by taking away any assistance your legs can provide. In the regular bench, the legs provide extra stability and pushing power to the lift. With this style, your upper body must stabilize and lift the entire weight of the bar. So obviously, you will not be able to use as much weight as you do in the regular bench. This forces your upper body to develop the stabilizing muscles used in the lift to a higher degree. Control of the weight in any lift is half the battle.
Next, this style does not stress the spine like the competitive bench does. Many lifters arch, as they should, to get maximum leverage and reduce the distance the bar must be pressed. Over a period of time, this can really add up on the spine and lumbar discs. Giving your back a break from arching can mean a longer lifting career with less pain and injuries. Also, if you're suffering from a back problem, this variation may enable you to get some productive bench work in the meantime. Check with a health professional first.
This variation also injects some variety into your routine. This is a great move to use as a substitute for the bench in your off season up to about 6 weeks prior a meet. Some lifters who need more or less time to adjust back to competitive style may have to adjust this time frame to fit their needs. It can also be used along with regular benches as a down set or finisher. I don't advise going below 3 reps with this move because of the decreased stability. Use about 30% less weight at first to break into the feel of this variation. The balance will be different and going too hard too fast may cause an injury. Have your spotter be alert and have him inform you if you are pushing crooked or out of the groove. If you bench with your butt off the bench so high you can drive a VW Bug under it, you will notice a big difference in the weight you can use safely. Keeping your back flat and your feet off the floor allows for maximum strictness. Don't swing your legs to gain extra leverage or you'll defeat the purpose of the move. This will also give you a better indication of your true benching power, especially if you cheat a lot.
This bench variation allows the same variations that the regular bench does like close grips, wide grips, benches to the neck, etc., so extra variety is available here too. Of course, don't go hog wild and do every type of variation you can think of. Remember, quality, not quantity. Give the ‘feet off the floor’ bench presses a try in the off season.
http://www.deepsquatter.com/strength/archives/ddani2.htm
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/07, 03:04 PM
this was a very informative thread. I've just started doing barbell presses and at first had my feet up. After reading this thread I tried it with my feet on the ground and let my back arch. I felt much stronger doing it this way and it was more comfortable for me. thanks for the insite!
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2006/06/10, 07:17 PM
everything can help...if used correctly
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/11, 05:54 AM
::tries 10 sets of 10lb DB curls in the squat cage while grunting on every rep::::
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2006/06/11, 12:04 PM
?
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/11, 01:58 PM
there's more than 1 way to any goal...but not everything has its place in a strength training program....
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2006/06/11, 06:33 PM
This is actually my first time reading this post....passed it numerous times just because of the silly title. I see folks doing benches with their feet in the air, and on the bench, just makes me want to run over and say, what are you, nuts? You cannot possibly be as strong, and more importantly, if you would slip or fail, where would you go? Accident waiting to happen. Train smart!!!!!!
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Quoting from flyonthewall:
this was a very informative thread. I've just started doing barbell presses and at first had my feet up. After reading this thread I tried it with my feet on the ground and let my back arch. I felt much stronger doing it this way and it was more comfortable for me. thanks for the insite!
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/06/11, 06:56 PM
They won't fall if they control themselves. And work within themselves.....theres no such thing as "wrong training"
Hell one year ago.....people on this board though it was "wrong" to heavly arch your back....myself included.
Which does put ALOT of stress on the lower back and disks.
I think its a nice change up....to give your back a lil rest...and really concentrate on form and how your moving the bar. Not just throwing the weight around.
menace not everyone wants to be a powerlifter....or a "strength" athlete. They just do it to keep in shape.
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Quoting from bb1fit:
This is actually my first time reading this post....passed it numerous times just because of the silly title. I see folks doing benches with their feet in the air, and on the bench, just makes me want to run over and say, what are you, nuts? You cannot possibly be as strong, and more importantly, if you would slip or fail, where would you go? Accident waiting to happen. Train smart!!!!!!
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/11, 07:09 PM
While this statement is true, you won't be much of anything if you have an "accident". That is what this type of training can very well lead to.
And when was it that folks on this board thought a slight arch in your back when benching was a bad thing????
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Quoting from bigandrew:
not everyone wants to be a powerlifter....or a "strength" athlete. They just do it to keep in shape.
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/06/11, 07:20 PM
I mean a powerlifting "BIG" arch....
I can easly get hurt doing a squat ...or in my case deadlift......you can get hurt with anything?
I have never falling off a bench...I don't see how when the weight is coming down on top of you?
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/11, 08:49 PM
Witout your feet to make a stable base if one arm gave out you would fall off.
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Less Talk, More Chalk!
The Men and Boys are Separated by one thing: The Squat Cage!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/06/12, 05:48 AM
Andrew dont get me wrong...I don't advocate big arch for everyone....you're twisting what I am saying...I ....HATE WHEN PEOPLE PUT THEIR FEET ON THE BENCH OR IN THE AIR.....it's more than anything a safety issue....many people who do this are complete newbies....they have no fukn clue as to what they are doing....so chances are these are the people likely to get hurt...
like I said there are better ways to train your 'core', chest, etc....this is as retarded as a guy doing barbell squats on a physio ball...
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2006/06/12, 09:37 PM
No if your arm gave out.. the weight would come crshing down on you...
Again......working within your self is key..not doing what you normally do on bench for a feet on ebnch attemp.
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Quoting from 7707mutt:
Witout your feet to make a stable base if one arm gave out you would fall off.
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/12, 10:17 PM
WEll this is one of those arguments that will never be solved. I feel that feet on the bench is a waste of time. I can get the same thing do rest pauses. And yes I have done the feet on the bench thing before. And Andrew regardless how much you stay within a certain weight limit fact is if one arm gives out it over balances that side, yes the bar crashes down but also to that side, the effect is you twist/fall towards that side, and fall off the bench.
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Less Talk, More Chalk!
The Men and Boys are Separated by one thing: The Squat Cage!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/06/13, 05:52 AM
Also u may notice some people bench with flat back but arch chest outward when lowering the bar....that's pretty dumb IMO...either use an arch or dont...i feel an arch is much safer on the lower back...beyond the extra weight i can get....
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2006/06/13, 07:41 AM
The whole dam point other than saftey...you limit yourself in what you can do. What good does that do? You are depriving yourself of the very thing you are attempting to do, overload the muscle.
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Quoting from bigandrew:
Again......working within your self is key..not doing what you normally do on bench for a feet on ebnch attemp.
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/06/13, 06:00 PM
hince the invention of the spotter?
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Quoting from 7707mutt:
WEll this is one of those arguments that will never be solved. I feel that feet on the bench is a waste of time. I can get the same thing do rest pauses. And yes I have done the feet on the bench thing before. And Andrew regardless how much you stay within a certain weight limit fact is if one arm gives out it over balances that side, yes the bar crashes down but also to that side, the effect is you twist/fall towards that side, and fall off the bench.
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/13, 08:49 PM
I don't get this argument. Presumably we are out to gain muscle, are we not? Why would you take a solid exercise like the bench press that you can effectively overload the chest muscle with good weight with, and take that ability away by having to use lighter weight with your feet up in the air or some silly crap? What possible purpose would this have?
Work within yourself, what crap for a line. It is as bad a word as toning.
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/06/13, 08:53 PM
Exactly it has noe goo duse except to make one look funny. Like I said Andrew if you want to isolate the chest do some nice rest pause....
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Less Talk, More Chalk!
The Men and Boys are Separated by one thing: The Squat Cage!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/06/15, 12:27 AM
mayeb its not for muscle....maybe its for strength?
If I get to wher ei can do my old max....feet on bench...then when my feet go on the floor.....should it not go up?
so what about close stance squats?
you loose stabilty bringing your feet in and you have to go lighter? Yet people still do those?
I seem to reamember menace almost falling doing 225 with a close stance squat?
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/15, 06:16 AM
Andrew bringing up my squatting is just wrong...LOL....the reason I fell over is because I went too low....and I can tell u it wasn't 'almost' ...i ended up benching that 225 on the floor..lmao...
no...people who put their feet on the bench are not doing it for strength purposes....
If u can get stronger with less stabilized forms of benching then you probably will get stronger overall on bench...however that's not a very effective or effecient way to get stronger...nor the most safe....
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2006/06/15, 12:31 PM
nor is close stance squatting lol
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/15, 04:36 PM
Think, man, think! For petes sake...While your weights drop due to the awkward position, and just working your way back up to a decent weight you can do in that position, how much could you have gained in strength by pounding away the heavy weight in that time doing a regular bench?
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Quoting from bigandrew:
mayeb its not for muscle....maybe its for strength?
If I get to wher ei can do my old max....feet on bench...then when my feet go on the floor.....should it not go up?
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/06/15, 05:25 PM
you wont get to the point where you can do your old max. It's just not that effective.
I'm not saying everyone should bench with an arch (although I do prescribe a slight arch for anyone I train) but theres no reason to not press from a stable base.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/06/15, 05:41 PM
so then a close stance squat and close grip bench is ineffective as well?
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/15, 07:46 PM
Apples and oranges BA. :dumbbell:
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Quoting from bigandrew:
so then a close stance squat and close grip bench is ineffective as well?
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/06/16, 04:15 AM
Andrew you are still way more stabilized doing close stance squats and close grip bench...then having feet in the air when benching...
for me close stance squatting...esp with plates under heels was the the strongest case scenario...which I highly doubt is the case for you with benching and having feet in the air or on bench...
close grip bench works because u can still use a lot of weight while being very well stabilized....and placing a lot of emphasis on the triceps/lockout...I can use 80-90% of 1rm for bench on close grip without the fear of falling over...
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2006/06/16, 07:45 AM
BA, I do notunderstand why you are arguing this! LOL come on man you are a power lifter! It comes down to this...people that preach feet up are scared to lift heavier weights and use the "tone and isolation" domga to sty away from benching heavy. A rest pause workout would do more for your bench than doing it with your feet up.
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Less Talk, More Chalk!
The Men and Boys are Separated by one thing: The Squat Cage!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/06/16, 06:44 PM
i'm just playing devil's advocate.
I understand about overload and stuff...stability issues etc.....
Close stance squat....you base is shifted inward, you can't do as much weight, you loose stabilty... To quote bb1" I thought the point was to over load the muscle?" You can't do that with close stance squats....nor really close grip bench...which put ALOT of stress on the wrists....
I'm nto putting anyone down or anything...btu everyoen is saying this excercise is useless...and giving me reasons...but I'm finding others that are the same...however those aren't useless...
So whys a close stance squat....benifical..yet feet on bench isn't?
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/17, 09:33 PM
Because a close stance squat is still a COMPOUND movement, and it allows enough weight to allow for overload. Your not taking any major muscle groups out of the equation. Whereas with benching with your feet in the air, you are taking out everything below and including your abdominals. Besides that, it puts unnecessary stress on your shoulders (and don't give me any of that arch is bad for your back bs).
And close stance squatting is very effective at building strength. Proof is in the numbers. I had the pleasure of watching a local olympic lifter (BW around 170) go ATG with a close stance and 365lbs on the bar like it was nothing.
For one thing, I don't think that bench press is that great a movement in the first place. Its HIGHLY overrated among americans, and does not deserve half the attention it gets. Why would you want to make it even less effective?
At that, I will leave this arguement with this... You are arguing, Andrew, with the same people that you have been asking for bringing up your bench, which you say sucks in comparison to your other lifts. No offense or anything, but the proof is in the numbers.
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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2006/06/18, 07:46 AM
Andrew I just feel like some exercises are pointless....benching with feet in the air, machine knee extensions, upright rows, squatting on a physio ball, etc...for many of these exercises there's a serious issue of safety being called into question....from messing up knees and shoulders to just plain risking your life...however every1 is free to make their own decisions....if u feel that this will help your bench then by all means go and do it...but from my experience it will only drop your bench....as wrestler pointed out you're essentially not only taking out your lower body out of the exercise but you're also forcing abs/core to work much harder to stabilize your body which removes the benefit of a big compound exercise....why not just do something different like DB bench press on physio ball?
From experience I have never seen anyone doing this exercise that had a good bench press....it's usually some kind of pencil thin guy working on his 'core'....or "to ease pressure on the lower back as to not hurt the it'......If i meet a guy that can do 300 while doing this i'll be amazed....
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2006/06/18, 05:56 PM
I don't put my feet in air...somtimes....when I do close grup I put my feet on the bench....just cause I have some back trouble....if it wasn't somthing worth a damn...I don't think deep squatter would have a article on it.
how is the bench press with feet on the bench no longer compound? it still involves more than 2 joints?
I box squat close stance....so i know how effective close stance is.
I leave this alone since peopel are contradicting themselves.
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Get your bicep curling, cut off shirt, matching workout outfit wearing,flexing in mirror "toned" wanna-be ass , out of my squat rack!
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/06/18, 07:36 PM
It's compound in that it involves multiple joints and muscle groups, but not nearly as much as a powerlifting or regular bench.
Don't give me bs about how deepsquatter said this, or some other site said that. They strive to provide different views. I think your being naive here.
And since you box squat close stance and have seen it work, how is benching with your feet in the air working for you? Or for any decent powerlifter for that matter?
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Iron and chalk.
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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