|
2005/09/29, 09:08 PM
Ok...as you guys know I had to talk to coach and everything about our workouts. And he's changed them for the good because we now do sprints and stuff instead of freakin cross country running. But there's still some problems. He has us do running (hard running) on Mon-Wed-Fri, and what he calls a leg day on Tues-Thurs. Leg days usually involve Ladder, Dot Drills, 3 sets of 1 minute wall sits and wall jumps, tons of lunges, and usually something strenuous like defensive slides or like today he had us giving each other piggy back rides while running. I had a 185 pound guy on my back. Anyways, I don't really get all that sore even though I also do my own workouts in the morning because of obvious reasons. I do pretty much everything I can to recover: eat right, stretch, contrast showers, etc. but for some reason I can't get my explosiveness back in my jumping that I used to have. I injured my achilles tendon this summer, so I spent up until the school year started to recover. I'm doing awesome workouts that involve everything I know and the best that I know. Am I overtraining? For some reason I just can't get my explosiveness back that I had. I've gotten much quicker and stronger, but I just can't JUMP!! It's killin me and the season's comin up...what do yall think?
--------------
I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
|
|
|
|
2005/09/29, 09:17 PM
Just out of curiousity, how much rest time do you give yourself each week?
--------------
Mike
in Pensacola Now.
|
|
2005/09/29, 10:53 PM
Well, as far as jumping goes, I do 3 workouts a week for it (Monday Wednesday Friday) in the morning before school, and then whatever coach has us do during 4th period. Saturday and Sunday are my only days that I am completely free from any leg activity. I do upper body Tuesday Thursday and Saturday. My morning jump training usually goes as follows:
Monday and Wednesday:
Explosive Box Squats, Explosive Stiff Legged Deadlifts, Explosive Olympic High Pulls, Isometric Deadlifting, and then power output training (Max Height Jumps, Step ups, and One Legged Hops)
Friday:
The above mentioned explosive lifts, followed by Depth Jumps
This plan worked like steroids for me about 5 months ago, but I also didn't have my 4th block workouts and got a lot more rest. I guess I'm gonna have to just tone it down. I just don't ever wanna leave stuff out ya know? I wish I could just quit everything but the SAQ stuff in my 4th period workouts. All the wall jumps, lunges, and wall sits are what I think is affecting my recovery.
--------------
I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
|
|
2005/09/29, 10:57 PM
So pretty much I know what is to blame for my lack of hops....my 4th period "workouts." I guess it just about has to be overdoing it to run your butt off 3 times a week, train for explosiveness 3 times a week, and do SAQs and coaches leg torture 2 times a week.
--------------
I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
|
|
2005/09/30, 05:12 AM
Aron u're simply draining your legs...I have same thing on a smaller scale....happens to me...obviously i don't do nearly as much workouts but even the ones I do...rob me of serious hops...I took a week off from training and then played bball with friends...my runnin vertical was huge....compared to usual...because I never allowed myself to recover ....
so u do 3 dynamic type workouts for legs a week? seems like you really are overworking you muscles....and when do you do max effort type work?
also don't forget to eat directly post workout...this is probably one of the best recovery oriented things you can do....
Have you tried taking baths with Epson Salt? it helps relax the muscles....
ZMA is good....
|
|
2005/10/01, 11:49 PM
I mean I guess I knew that this was way too much training, but I have been doing so much to recover like stretching, contrast showers, eating directly post workout, taking supplements and stretching that I didn't get sore. I haven't really gotten very sore at all this year, but my legs are often dead when it comes to jumping. It's actually kinda scary cuz my left achilles tendon is starting to hurt right where it connects to the calf. I guess I'm going to reduce my morning workouts and stop trying so hard on the wall jumps and other useless things that coach has us do. It just sucks because I know what I need to do for my vertical, but it's like I'm just not getting the recovery I need because of useless things that we do in bball conditioning. Thing is I don't know what I should cut out of my morning workouts. I guess I could definitely reduce the explosive lifts to once or twice a week, but I know that I definitely need to keep up the power output training twice a week. I hate to say it, but I guess I'll take out the third day which includes the depth jumps and explosive lifts, and give myself two days in between the jumping days. Heck, maybe I should kinda mix the West Side routine with my routine and do a dynamic/max effort day with power output on both days?
--------------
I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
|
|
2005/10/01, 11:54 PM
Sorry that might be confusing. What I meant to say was do a dynamic day with power output and then 72 hours later, do a max effort day with power output (not dynamic and max effort in the same day). Has anyone ever done Jump Squats with bands? I've been thinkin about using my minis for some jump squats with just the bar or somethin. Like 3 sets of 5 kinda deal or somethin like that?
--------------
I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
|
|
2005/10/02, 09:41 PM
bump
--------------
I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
|
|
2005/10/03, 02:03 AM
aron....I hate to say it but I'd cut down to max of 1 leg dynamic workout per week and maybe 1 strength workout once every 7-14 days.....outside of whatever else it is you guys are doing.....you're killing yourself....working hard is one thing but this is overtraining if I ever saw it....your dynamic workouts, plyometrics, etc....all train legs in a similar way.....hence you're doing like 5 workouts for your legs.....with all the plyo you're doing, I'd consider dropping dynamic lifts all together for legs...And I would pick a day and go all out on that dynamic day for plyo, and then go <50% on all others(I know giving it half ass doesn't seem good...but you're killing yourself...)...
Jump Squats with bands? dude you're REALLY overtraining as it is...you'll kill your body with this....bands are hard on the joints and connective tissues.....with all the work you're doing....I'd maybe save that for the summer...
|
|
2005/10/03, 02:06 AM
basically it's like me asking you...aron I do squats 7 days a week....but I do dynamic stretching beforehand, static stretching afterwards, I do hot/cold shower, I try to do some recovery work every other day along with my regular work....I seem to be doing 1/3 of my usual max...what gives?...
anywayz takes it easy and give your body much needed rest....
|
|
2005/10/03, 10:34 PM
Yeah, you're right I have been overtraining. When I mentioned the Jump Squats I was just thinkin about doing them as a workout just for a change up. Today I did some squats and then power output in the morning, and we ran pretty hard this afternoon. I was getting up better during 4th period and actually dunking better than I have been. But a downside is that the top part of the back of my thighs are really gettin sore and my butt's feelin that way too. It's cuz I hadn't done heavy squats in so long. What really sucks is that coach's leg day is tomorrow which consists of wall jumps, wall sits, lunges, and I am most definitely gonna give half effort at most on it....heck maybe it could be used for recovery. I'm plannin on doing a really light dynamic day with power output afterwards on Friday and just seein what happens if I take out one of my days and then try a lot less on coach's stuff. I will reduce as much as necessary, and I may just check out early one day during 4th period or just talk to coach because he will understand. Anyways, this is my plan as of now:
Monday: Max Effort type lifting with Power Output training
Running (Pretty good intensity)
Tuesday: No morning work
Coach's Leg Day (barely tryin)
Wednesday: Dynamic upper body
Running (Low to Moderate Intensity)
Thursday: No morning work
Coach's Leg Day (barely tryin)
Friday: Very light Dynamic legs, Power Output Training
Free day in 4th period
Saturday: Max Effort upper body
Sunday: Completely Off--Lord's Day
--------------
I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
|
|
2005/10/03, 10:36 PM
I still have a feeling that this may be a bit much, but we'll see.
--------------
I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
|
|
2005/10/04, 12:07 AM
here's a suggestion:
Friday: sleep. no workout
Also where you say 'no morning work' I must assume you mean there's a team practice....so then...
you do 1 max effort day and 5 dynamic days .....this is overtraining still....just don't do any dynamic work on your own....like I said pick 1 day and do a good dynamic workout with your team...the rest of them half-ass or talk to your coach and tell him that you're about to die of exhaustion....
No recovery technique is going to help you recover....also consider this ...it takes as much as 4 times the amount to recover from overtraining as it takes to get to that point...so keep that in mind....2 weeks overtraining=8 weeks to recover completely before you started overtraining...
|
|
2005/10/04, 12:07 AM
err don't do any dynamic LEG workouts on your own
|
|
2005/10/04, 04:05 AM
I would say if there is any pain then rest it. You know it makes sense. Maybe take glucosomine?
--------------
each to their own
|
|
2005/10/04, 11:08 AM
I generally do as follows supplement wise for the joints:
1500/1200/500mg of glocousomine/choindroitin/MSM(before sleep)
Fish Oil(twice a day of 2g)
Gator pointed out some people(who have diabetes) can have some complications from glucosomine/choindroitin...so checking with your doc is a good idea before taking it...
|
|
2005/10/04, 04:19 PM
I take glucosamine/chondroitin/msm every morning and fish oil every night. Menace, I guess I never considered what my team does to be "dynamic work", but I guess sprinting, saq ladders, and dot drills would be classified as that. I think I'm going to do what you said and not do any dynamic lifts on Fridays. Today coach only made us do ladders and dots and it was nothing, so I was pretty glad cuz those squats made me really sore.
So we'll try this one more time:
Monday: Morning: Max Effort Legs with Power Output
4th Period: Run
Tuesday: No morning workouts
4th Period: Ladder, Dots, etc. (low effort)
Wednesday: Morning: Dynamic Upper Body
4th Period: Run
Thursday: Morning: Power Output
4th Period: Same as Tuesday
Friday: No Morning Workout
4th Period: No Workout
I dunno...I guess this will all just have to be trial and error kinda thing for me.
--------------
I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
|
|
2005/10/04, 04:21 PM
All I know is I need to try my best to do the Power Output exercises twice a week because they are the most effective thing for me right now. So, just keep that in mind that I really need to keep doing power output twice, even if it means taking out max effort lifts.
--------------
I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
|
|
2005/10/04, 06:20 PM
yea it definitely is trial and error...if this was off-season you can do plyometric exercises 3 times a week....and get great results...but here you're literally killing yourself...I mean you do morning exercises, then team, and so forth....if you think about it you weren't even doing just 4-5 workouts, but you were doing almost double that, because you were doing 3-4 dynamic leg workouts on your own and then more of the same with the team, and you were pushing yourself the whole time....not to mention all the running you do....I just can't imagine how you can possibly recover from all that....but at least you're cutting down so that's good....hope it works for you....
take care
|
|
2005/10/04, 06:34 PM
Thanks for the responses and input, Menace.
--------------
I firmly believe that any man's finest hour, the greatest fulfillment of all that he holds dear, is the moment when he has worked his heart out in a good cause and lies exhausted on the field of battle-victorious.
--Vince Lombardi
"Decide what you want, decide what you are willing to exchange for it. Establish your priorities and go to work." H. L. Hunt
|
