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2005/02/07, 01:54 AM
Hello all,
Let me cut to the chase:
1) Is there an effective alternative to bent-over barbell rows (preferably a machine) that builds mass on the back? I was thinking the hammer strengh iso-lateral rowing machine, but am unsure.
2) What part of the back do close-grip pulldowns work and is is worth doing after already starting my back routine doing {normal} lat pulldowns?
3) For a lat pulldown or seated row to be effective, when going heavier, does the bar have to touch your chest?
Thanks guys... darn Patriots...
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2005/02/07, 07:55 AM
There are other exercises for the bent over row( I love it and find it to be the best), one is the T-bar row, most gyms come equiped with various seated row machines.
what kind of close grip are you talking about? There are a few different handles you can use. For the most part the pulldows work the lats....as a rule I do not usually do 2 latpulldown exercises in the same workout, as I feel they are overkill. However I also do chins and deadlifts so my lats are getting a large workout.
As for touching the chest it is nice but when going heavy you can "cheat" a little. By that I mean try to hit your chest, and by no means cheat each time. hope this all helps
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If you can itch your nose after arm day...do another set!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2005/02/07, 01:32 PM
Thanks 7707mutt...
I have a question though... here's the back routine I have recently started. Do you think it's okay for someone trying to get a wider, thicker back? Your comments please...
1) Lat pull downs (5 sets)
2) bent over barbell rows (4 sets) {might replace w/ hammer strength machine)
3) close grip lat pull downs (5 sets) {don't know if I'm usting the right handle...}
4) seated row machine (4 sets)
5) *NEED another exercise for lower back*
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2005/02/07, 01:54 PM
First thing off I think you are doing to many sets for back. If you can do all those sets you may need to add weight and or up the intensity. Ok, do you workout at a gym? If so see if they have what is called an assisted chin machine. This will give you "help" to do chins. That is a great way to add thickness and size to your back. As for lower back do deadlifts and hyperextension....not on the same day but switch week to week...hope this mad sense.
here is my workout for back
assisted chins 3-4 sets
bent rows 3-4 set
deadlifts set depend on if I am going light or heavy....total is 10-12 sets maybe 14 sets...good luck I lift at home..
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If you can itch your nose after arm day...do another set!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2005/02/07, 01:55 PM
usually one need to touch the chest and "squeeze" a lil.....that is contract all muscles you want to work. Hold for two.....then slowly "uncoil" those muscles......I imagine "pulling" from my elbows and not my hands.
As for different grips.....wider the grip... themore it will widen your back more so, than a closer grip.
I'd keep the bent over rows in there.... yes they are a pain.....bu tyou get alot of benifits, you work out all your stablizers, grip everything in one setting. So i'd switch and do bent over rows 1st, so you have the most engery.....plus the "stretch" of the pull downs might keep you fropm being as sore from them.
As for your extra excercise, roman dls are pretty good, as is good mornings for the lower back, or back extensions.... both willalso help with your squat and dls. If your not already doing dls I think you should be.
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My drinking squad, has a cheerleading problem!!
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2005/02/07, 02:11 PM
Thanks guys... I have more questions though... (sorry, but I just am unsure about a lot of things...)
>>When doing Bent-over rows, how far up do I bring the barbell? I've been bringing it up to my upper chest, but heard from numerous sources that it should be to the lower chest...
>>Also, my biggest question is rep scheme... bigandrew I know I've already asked you this before, but I am so confused...
Is pyramiding going 8, 6, 4, 2 on all exercises good for trying to gain mass on all exercises (ie; bench, bb curls)? My arms have gotten bigger, but I have a long ways to go and just want to make sure I'm building mass the most effective way. Please help... I have no clue... Is 10, 8, 6, 4 better??? I don't know...
Thanks... (I know bb1fit had a great post, but I am still unclear on what rep scheme to stick with...)
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2005/02/07, 03:55 PM
There is no one set scheme to stick with. When you stick with one routine then this is when people hit the "plateau" and maybe end up quitting altogether. You want to do what is good for you and what gives you results that you want. If you are seeing gains then stick with the pyramid scheme. When you start to level out and not see gains then you may want to switch to a more heavy strength gaining routine. (ex. 5 sets of 5 going heavy) or a circuit training, whatever to give your a body a shock and to continue building. People on the site tend to agree that is a good idea to switch up your routine every 6-8 weeks. The fitness plans on the site are setup for 8 or 12 week increments I believe. Bottom line is do what is getting the results you want, but don't stick with one routine for a long time.
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2005/02/07, 05:05 PM
anything lower than a 5 rep... is for th emost part for strength training......keep for th emost part reps above 6.....15-8 reps is what I kept mine at when I was more into bodybuilding. I went as heavy as I could, for those eloted reps, however they where kept fairly high. Worked pretty good too.
This is what I used to judge different rep schemes.
mass builders I kept reps moderate 12-8 mostly. This would include, benching,rowing,squats, dls....etc....mutijoint movements.
For skulpting movemnets.....tricep push downs(rope) flys, leg extensions.....these ar eusually one joint, or one muscle being worked. I kept high, and concentrated on the feel and squeeze of the reps.....I kept these reps over 10+ going somtimes as high as a 15 rep, but no lower than a 10.
:dumbbell:
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My drinking squad, has a cheerleading problem!!
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