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2006/10/06, 10:42 PM
Had to post this! I have tried almost every supplement know to man! I've been lifting for about 3 years. About 6 months ago I decided to give all the supplements up except for taking a multi vitamin every day. Instead of a protein shake after my workout I drink a big glass of skim milk. I put all clean foods and lots of protein in my diet. Lots of chicken, tuna, red meat once or twice a week and lots of vegetables and fruits. I also eat 6 smaller meals a day. And voila! I am bigger and more cut than any of those supplements could have ever made me! THE KEY IS DIET AND INTENSE WORKOUTS! Supplements are mostly hype! A good nights sleep will do you better than a scoop of that B.S.
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2006/10/07, 09:38 AM
I have to agree with you fouts....my husband put on more muscle with just food than any supplements...He ate tuna with his workouts instead of a protien shake...and he kept it much easier too.But me...I can't eat that much protien..so the shakes work better for me.
Mostly I wanted to say thanks for filling out your profile...:)
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2006/10/07, 12:27 PM
Now that is definitely a good point but my real problem is are we sure that that is actually protein in those shakes? The FDA does not regulate any of this stuff so for all we know that is dirt in those containers. NBC had a special on where they marketed a drug successfully that was nothing more than coffee grounds and claimed it would dramatically enhance the look of your skin and other things. They even got people that claimed it worked for them and put out a commercial. So in the words of Flavor Flav "Don't believe the hype!" Try to get everything naturally.
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2006/10/07, 12:36 PM
The placebo effect...what you percieve to be reality..is reality.Well I hope I'm not drinking dirt...that would really stink!!:big_smile:
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2006/10/07, 01:45 PM
I have to dissagree on the PWO, Whey Protien serves a great purpose in a fast active release to help repair and recover faster and I love it and it works best.
I too eat tuna for a meal after my workoutss but the Whey comes 1st and then meal is anywhere from 30 minutes to 45 mintues after!
I do agree alot of sups are crap but I do beleive alot or great and Whey to by 1 of them!
IMO Whey as a PWO in water only with nothing eles aded is a must have, then go have a meal!
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2006/10/07, 03:09 PM
I have wrote on supplements many, many times. Just think about it, how many of you have found any of the 'diet' stuff to work? Why would the size gaining crap be any better?
However, I do agree with SFGiants partially.....one part of the statement, whey post workout can be vital. Though not necessary. I would add in some milk to make it more nutritious. This will also give you a nice blend of fast and slow digesting protein. In fact, studies have shown that casein pretty well smokes whey in muscle gain.
Though milk by itself can and should do fine....2 glasses, 16 gr. of protein, 24 gr. of carbs. A good 2-1 ratio.
I was in the whey/dex/water camp for quite a while. Followed the 'science' from way back in the 90's. Paul Cribb to his credit was the first I knew of to come up with this 'theory'. Well, tons of folks have done this for a long time now, myself as one...and guess what, I have seen in myself or anyone else I train or work out with make any substantial gains. You would think by now if this was the ultimate recovery, more mass monsters would be around.
The more I research the 'science' of bodybuilding, the more I go back to basics I learned many years ago. Lift heavy, eat well, rest well. Repeat. I by the way have studies to back up the milk bit.
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/10/07, 04:26 PM
Sweet! So adding Milk is good for PWO, Sweet it taste better in Milk!
Looks like I'll be taking foot out of mouth and go with Whey in Milk for PWO!
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Quoting from bb1fit:
I have wrote on supplements many, many times. Just think about it, how many of you have found any of the 'diet' stuff to work? Why would the size gaining crap be any better?
However, I do agree with SFGiants partially.....one part of the statement, whey post workout can be vital. Though not necessary. I would add in some milk to make it more nutritious. This will also give you a nice blend of fast and slow digesting protein. In fact, studies have shown that casein pretty well smokes whey in muscle gain.
Though milk by itself can and should do fine....2 glasses, 16 gr. of protein, 24 gr. of carbs. A good 2-1 ratio.
I was in the whey/dex/water camp for quite a while. Followed the 'science' from way back in the 90's. Paul Cribb to his credit was the first I knew of to come up with this 'theory'. Well, tons of folks have done this for a long time now, myself as one...and guess what, I have seen in myself or anyone else I train or work out with make any substantial gains. You would think by now if this was the ultimate recovery, more mass monsters would be around.
The more I research the 'science' of bodybuilding, the more I go back to basics I learned many years ago. Lift heavy, eat well, rest well. Repeat. I by the way have studies to back up the milk bit.
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2006/10/07, 04:37 PM
My current favorite is 3 scoops of Mass Maker(loaded with casein and egg), a scoop of high grade whey isolate, mix in water and chug down. Followed immediately by a 4-6 oz. of chocolate milk. What a treat!
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/10/07, 04:40 PM
A repost of my post on this some time back....featured interpretation from Lyle McDonald....
Alright guys, hold on to your hats. I and all of us have fallen prey to the supplement companies' telling us we have to have whey isolate and dextrose or a pre made type. My SPIDER SENSE was tingling all along, as I am an old schooler and remember the days we drank milk, ate steaks, etc. after training, and made nice gains. Well, I went along with all that and even preached the whey/dextrose philosophy. Well, lo and behold, check this out. Sometimes, the more we learn about this stuff, the more we should revert back to the basics. They worked then and always will. Read on....
Elliot TA et. al. Milk ingestion stimulates net muscle protein synthesis following resistance exercise. Med Sci Sports Exerc. (2006) 38(4):667-74.
PURPOSE: Previous studies have examined the response of muscle protein to resistance exercise and nutrient ingestion. Net muscle protein synthesis results from the combination of resistance exercise and amino acid intake. No study has examined the response of muscle protein to ingestion of protein in the context of a food. This study was designed to determine the response of net muscle protein balance following resistance exercise to ingestion of nutrients as components of milk. METHOD: Three groups of volunteers ingested one of three milk drinks each: 237 g of fat-free milk (FM), 237 g of whole milk (WM), and 393 g of fat-free milk isocaloric with the WM (IM). Milk was ingested 1 h following a leg resistance exercise routine. Net muscle protein balance was determined by measuring amino acid balance across the leg. RESULTS: Arterial concentrations of representative amino acids increased in response to milk ingestion. Threonine balance and phenylalanine balance were both > 0 following milk ingestion. Net amino acid uptake for threonine was 2.8-fold greater (P < 0.05) for WM than for FM. Mean uptake of phenylalanine was 80 and 85% greater for WM and IM, respectively, than for FM, but not statistically different. Threonine uptake relative to ingested was significantly (P < 0.05) higher for WM (21 +/- 6%) than FM (11 +/- 5%), but not IM (12 +/- 3%). Mean phenylalanine uptake/ingested also was greatest for WM, but not significantly. CONCLUSIONS: Ingestion of milk following resistance exercise results in phenylalanine and threonine uptake, representative of net muscle protein synthesis. These results suggest that whole milk may have increased utilization of available amino acids for protein synthesis.
My comments: If nothing else, this study should be interesting to any old timers/lifting historians who subscribe to the newsletter. For decades, bulking up was traditionally done by lifting heavy (especially the 20 rep squat routine) and drinking gallons of whole milk. And now, years later, we have a study supporting what lifters were doing the whole time (before fat phobia and the anti-milk nonsense infected bodybuilding).
A number of studies have examined the impact of nutrient intake both before and after resistance training but typically supplements have been used. This study set out to examine two different aspects of post-workout nutrition: the impact of nutrients found in whole food (in this case milk) on protein balance post-workout as well as comparing skim to whole milk.
Comparing skim milk, whole milk and skim milk containing the same number of calories as the whole milk; all the drinks were given one hour following resistance training. Following two different amino acid tracers, the researchers found that whole milk actually gave the greatest response in terms of muscular uptake of the aminos although the difference only reached statistical significance for one of the aminos examined. As well, the researchers noted a rather large variability in response between the different subjects and an explanation of the difference between the whole and skim milk trials was neither studied specifically nor given.
In any case, all three drinks successfully promoted protein gains following weight training and milk may provide a near ideal post-workout food in that it contains a combination of casein and whey (the ratio found in milk is 80% casein/20% whey) along with some simple sugars. This is in addition to a number of nutrients including dairy calcium (which some studies suggest impacts on fat loss and calorie partitioning). Two glasses of milk will contain 16 grams of protein along with 24 grams of carbs and can make an effective post-workout drink (fat content will depend on what type of milk is chosen, skim, 1 or 2% or whole milk); lactose intolerant individuals can use products like Lactaid (lactose removed milk).
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/10/07, 05:04 PM
20 oz. of milk alone provides a good amount of both casein and whey protein. And you can only really synthesize 20-25 grams of protein in one sitting so I still think that the protein powder is just a waste of money for a PWO shake. Besides I haven't seen a protein powder yet that has the sugar needed to increase your insulin levels after your workout, but I can tell you what does. That's right MILK! But I will definitely agree that if you have found something that you really believe works by all means use it. I'm not saying that protein shakes do not work. Heck, even the placebo effect can have a positive impact. I would just suggest to everyone to do a little reading and try the natural approach. Cut out the overpriced supplements and use what God gave you!
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2006/10/07, 05:06 PM
Phoooeeyyy...<quote> 'You can only really synthesize 20-25 gr. of protein in one sitting'.
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/10/07, 05:12 PM
Fouts, I think that you could possibly be barking up the wrong tree with this post.
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Break bread wit the enemy//
But no matter how many cats I break bread wit/
I\'ll break who you sendin me/ (DMX)
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2006/10/07, 05:13 PM
phooeeyy.....thats more like it bb1...that I can understand!!
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2006/10/07, 06:59 PM
I know I have stated before that I think there is too much taken in a PWO, Like when someone said they take 75g's but then again it's all in my own ignorance and forgetfulness that there are people trying to bulk and that's when I really put my feet in my mouth because all I think about is the diet end of things.
I get too grateful for what's happening for me I forget to leave the answering of the ?'s up to the real people of knowledge, the ones teaching me like BB1FIT and the other Staff!
Sometimes I look back at a response I have made and just shake my head, I'm just at a real excited point in my life from gaining results but I have to check myself better from now on and remember where and from who I learned what I did and back off a bit in responses and learn a whole lot more before shooting off at the keyboard!:(
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2006/10/07, 07:05 PM
Well maybe I said it wrong. Quoted from Jeff Volek, Ph.D., R.D., a professor of exercise physiology at the University of Connecticut: "After a certain point -about 20-25 grams- adding protein to a meal no longer helps promote protein synthesis. That means getting more than 20-25 grams of protein in one sitting WON'T help you build more muscle." I'm not barking up the wrong tree at all. Listen I was taking two scoops of protein powder (roughly around 48 grams of protein) after my workouts for a long time and as soon as I switched to a tall glass of milk I started seeing the results I was wanting all along and not seeing from protein powder. Eating large amounts of protein helps you burn more calories of course and it keeps you fuller longer but getting 48 grams of protein was not making any more difference as getting 20 grams from 20 oz of milk. By all means prove me wrong, I can take it.
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2006/10/07, 07:12 PM
One more thing, I'm definitely not saying that just drinking milk will make you bigger. But my diet hasn't changed except for the milk and I have added muscle and lost fat since the milk PWO. I know that there is a lot of useful information on this site and alot posted by bb1fit but the majority of the posts contain info derived from other people such as doctors and scientists.
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2006/10/07, 07:12 PM
awww....MVP...don't feel so bad...we're all learning...well 95% of us...at least you didn't get called an idiot...or told you must only have a first grade reading level...we're all learning...sometimes it takes an improper answer to get to the truth of things.It's humbeling...to admit you may have been wrong...but don't stop answering questions...you've been helpful on many occasions.
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2006/10/07, 07:43 PM
KC - I did not know you were up a level.
Just kidding :laugh::laugh::laugh:
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Life is a lesson. You will learn it when you are gone.
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2006/10/07, 07:45 PM
It's funny cause in just a minute of research I found that the average person can absorb 40-50g of proetein in one sitting. You really want to check on more than one source before you start preaching.
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Break bread wit the enemy//
But no matter how many cats I break bread wit/
I\'ll break who you sendin me/ (DMX)
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2006/10/07, 08:03 PM
:big_smile:
============
Quoting from KC_72:
awww....MVP...don't feel so bad...we're all learning...well 95% of us...at least you didn't get called an idiot...or told you must only have a first grade reading level...we're all learning...sometimes it takes an improper answer to get to the truth of things.It's humbeling...to admit you may have been wrong...but don't stop answering questions...you've been helpful on many occasions.
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2006/10/07, 08:20 PM
ka....have you joined the dark side????I'm supposed to get notice of these things....
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2006/10/07, 08:42 PM
I didn't think I was preaching but yes your body can take in a large amount of protein, but as far as protein synthesis goes there is a cutoff point. The excess protein is used as energy. Which is a good thing though. Protein takes more effort to digest which helps burn more calories and it keeps you feeling fuller longer. You can't OD on protein. A high protein diet is the best. And yes there are different proteins and they are absorbed at different rates. But honestly I didn't post this to discuss protein shakes. I am just saying that most of the supplements are pure crap and until the FDA regualtes stuff like this there is not really a surety of what you are consuming.
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2006/10/07, 08:50 PM
Well.... that is true
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Break bread wit the enemy//
But no matter how many cats I break bread wit/
I\'ll break who you sendin me/ (DMX)
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2006/10/09, 04:41 PM
Who says that the government sticking their big foot in our supplements will solve all of our problems. You can take a scoop of this and send it to a private lab and have it analysed if you're that concerned about it. That's the great thing about capitalism...yes a company can try to pull the rug over your eyes if they choose. However eventually they will get found out and when they do they typically will be paying for it with lack of customers and lawsuits.
Regardless I tend to agree that milk is probably better in conjunction with a whey protein then just 1 or the other. And chocolate milk is yummy to boot.
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2006/10/10, 12:47 PM
Can't believe there is still shit like this still out there. I would love to see one shred of solid evidence to back this up. 'Doctors' and 'nutritionists' have been saying this crap for years, now they are finally backing off. Tough to argue with morons. No times more optimal than others?
So, there is a 'magic number' of 20-25, huh? So the body magically knows that uh oh, he took in 26 gr.of protein, don't synthesize that last gram.
The body will use and yes, synthesize whatever amount it needs. If it needs 1 gr. it will use that, if it needs 70 gr. it will utilize that.
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Quoting from fouts:
I didn't think I was preaching but yes your body can take in a large amount of protein, but as far as protein synthesis goes there is a cutoff point. The excess protein is used as energy. Which is a good thing though. Protein takes more effort to digest which helps burn more calories and it keeps you feeling fuller longer. You can't OD on protein. A high protein diet is the best. And yes there are different proteins and they are absorbed at different rates. But honestly I didn't post this to discuss protein shakes. I am just saying that most of the supplements are pure crap and until the FDA regualtes stuff like this there is not really a surety of what you are consuming.
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/10/10, 01:01 PM
If the governemtn steps in and bans andro because of the obvious side effects then i think it should give a **** about all the other crap that comes out and have at least some sort of requirement for purity. thats my opinion. or maybe people should stop being morons and going out and buying every product that comes out, but thats a long shot. i agree with bb1fit that slowly the bad companies get weeded out, but sometimes the ones like musclteck dont, and while they have good protein they keep making all this other crap, a new supp every month, and so ppl say hey they have good protein this must be good too. but whatever, if your gullable enough then maybe u should be fooled.
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2006/10/10, 02:42 PM
You just really have to do your homework on supplements. Research, research, and research more. We all work hard for our money, no need to 'give' it away.
Elantraa makes a good post. Things like andro(pro hormones) got banned for one reason though...too easy access for morons who don't have a clue to use. The posts I have read from folks getting this stuff backs it up. Probably more than half had not a clue about PCT, what it even was.
These can and are dangerous to the average joe that uses them thinking they are going to gain a ton of muscle and not 'pay a price'. They are not 'over the counter' supplements, those do not alter hormone profile. When you start to mess with your hormones with no clue, bad things happen that can last literally a lifetime.
By the way, Muscletech was sued and filed a subsequent chapter 11(I believe it was in Canada, will have to dig it up). But it is a drop in the bucket for those guys.
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/10/10, 03:46 PM
Carbs repair muscle how is that? Muscle are made up of Protien and it is the protein we eat that repair them, that and rest, carbs give us energy. Get you facts right before spouting of stuff like that. And hey no one here said follow those mags!
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A journey beigns with a single step.
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/10/10, 05:35 PM
I'm with Mutt, Plus I always hear the guys on this site say NOT to listen to the mags, and every body here knows that you can get all the same or better effects from food alone. About the protein vs carbs, Null, sorry your miss informed I think. Protein builds muscle and carbs give you energy cause I believe they break down into sugar. But I am not a doctor I am a carpenter, but we do think we know everything.
Mutt, No hard feelings about yesterday? I was just having a bad day.
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Break bread wit the enemy//
But no matter how many cats I break bread wit/
I\'ll break who you sendin me/ (DMX)
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2006/10/10, 06:06 PM
Actually Mutt carbohydrates after workouts speeds glycogen replacement in the muscles leading to faster recovery. Look it up.
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2006/10/10, 06:20 PM
Humm for me and my body type along with genetics, Lots of Carbs = Lots of Fat even if it's all GOOD Carbs, Lots of Protein = More Muscle Mass!
It's here I learned Carbs are my friend and I'm not afraid of them as I use to be but with a higher Protein intake and Lower Carb and I'm not talking about a pre contest amount I mean like 40% to 45% of my intake and on some day even lower them 40% but not lower the 35%! This may seem to anal for some but I'm Carb sensitive now matter how good the carbs are!
Here is and example in my life, High Carbs Low Protein kept me fat like 21% BF and no matter of the amount I would lift I would have small nothing muscles. High Protein Medium Carbs = lower BF% Mid to low teens and a way more muscular look, although I'm not a competition type looking guy I'm also not looking like too skinny of a guy with no muscle!
Oh yeah High Protein has a real down fall though, High Protein = High Fart ratio LOL, but I just bought some fart be gone and I hope it works and doesn't need to be taken with every meal LOL!
Threads like this make me fell better about myself for when I stick feet in mouth!
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2006/10/10, 06:35 PM
Let me reiterate one more time: AFTER WORKOUTS! Eating a lot of carbs all day and little protein is not smart at all. An ample amount of high glycemic carbs is a great way to help the muscles recover after a workout. You can find that said by many bodybuilders and nutritionists I'm sure. Protein is also very important. You just have to know how to balance the ratio.
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2006/10/10, 06:52 PM
Hey Guys! Who here wants too look like most Doctor's and Scientist?
We'll my answer is simple, Not Me!, I'll settle for listing to not only Educated Bodybuilders and Fitness Gurus for their (Wisdom) and (Knowledge) but because they are the ones showing me(RESULTS) that work and stay working!
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2006/10/10, 07:01 PM
Where do you think they get most of their information?
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2006/10/10, 08:22 PM
I did look it up and I know whats up now. You are referring to a low carb high protein diet. When your carb intake is to low your body will use protein instead to make energy. In turn the protein is not rebuilding muscle. Simply cause your carb intake is low. If you have a good % of both carb and protein the protein is used for building muscle and carbs are energy. the whole point is LOW CARB DIETS ARE BAD FOR YOU. Now look that up fouts and read the whole article instead of one line. SF and Mutt know what they are talking about from experiance.
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Break bread wit the enemy//
But no matter how many cats I break bread wit/
I\'ll break who you sendin me/ (DMX)
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2006/10/10, 11:08 PM
No I was not referring to a low carb high protein diet! I was simply stating that high glycemic carbs after a workout help to replace glycogen which is vital for muscle repair. Protein is also very important but your carbs should be at a higher ratio than protein roughly 2:1 which you do not get from whey protein shakes. Most have little to no carbs. You can get alot of crap off the internet but the info about the carbs after a workout comes from many articles and a bodybuilder who is doing this research and proving it for his PHD. You can find many articles backing up what I said about the high glycemic carbs after training. My point had nothing to do with low carb diets and I don't need to look that up because I knew that was bad for you before the Atkins trend even started. All of these methods followed by bodybuilders are formed on the basis of what science tells us. Supplement companies claim SCIENCE to back up their claims on every product! Science is how we found out how the body works in the first place. Bodybuilding is a science of it's own. Need anymore examples? And I added in my post before that you have to know how to balance the ratio of carbs and protein. Maybe you didn't read that part.
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2006/10/11, 07:32 AM
WELL YES YOUR CARBS TO PROTEIN RATIO SHOULD BE 2:1 BUT YOU SAID PROTEIN DOESN'T REBUILD MUSCLE. CORRECT? THAT IS FALSE. I THINK MAYBE I MISUNDERSTOOD YOU ALONG WITH A FEW PEOPLE. BOTTOM LINE, PROTEIN BUILDS MUSCLE AND CARBS GIVE YOU ENERGY, CARBS 2 PROTEIN 1. SO WE ALL ARE RIGHT WE ARE JUST SAYING IT IN A DIFFERENT WAY SO LETS MOVE ON FROM THIS POINTLESS ARGUMENT. BY THE WAY ALL FOOD (ALMOST ALL FOODS) HAVE MORE CARBS THEN PROTEIN ANY WAY
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Break bread wit the enemy//
But no matter how many cats I break bread wit/
I\'ll break who you sendin me/ (DMX)
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2006/10/11, 07:35 AM
Protein -
213 g .. maximum 10% variance is acceptable
Carbohydrates -
595 g .. maximum 10% variance is acceptable
Fats -
76 g .. maximum 10% variance is acceptable
Total Calories -
3811 .. calculated maximum, do not exceed for current goal
this is my current goal for each day
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Break bread wit the enemy//
But no matter how many cats I break bread wit/
I\'ll break who you sendin me/ (DMX)
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2006/10/11, 07:53 AM
fouts your post stated simply: carbs repair muscle. That is not true yes they help to speed recovery, but in reality they do not REBUILD (repair) Muscle. Protein does that. You look it up!
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A journey beigns with a single step.
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/10/11, 08:09 AM
go get em
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Well I love her
But I love to fish
I spend all day out on this lake
And hell is all I catch
But today she met me at the door
Said I would have to choose
If I hit that fishin hole today
She\\\\'d be packin all her things
And she\\\\'d be gone by noon
Well I\\\\'m gonna miss her
When I get home (Brad Paisly)
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2006/10/11, 09:06 AM
jeramie??????quoting a country song....yep...must be a full moon....
and your protien is almost the same as mine for a day????And your carbs....wish I could eat that many...I only get like 80...why do you get so many???
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2006/10/11, 09:15 AM
That is what this site set up for me cause honestly human biology is not my area of expertise. I am slightly educated but mostly clueless.
I love country, It is hillbilly rap. They all talk about the same stuff. Drinkin, girls and how hard life is. I found in my old age (26) (no offense to any one) My taste are changing a bit. Plus I love to fish so I relate to this song. I still love rap cauise I was raised in an urban enviroment.
Oh as far as carbs go, I am very active in my day other then work out. At work I burn more cal. than the average person does in two days (?).
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Well I love her
But I love to fish
I spend all day out on this lake
And hell is all I catch
But today she met me at the door
Said I would have to choose
If I hit that fishin hole today
She\\\\'d be packin all her things
And she\\\\'d be gone by noon
Well I\\\\'m gonna miss her
When I get home (Brad Paisly)
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2006/10/11, 09:17 AM
look how skinny I am and I eat like a pig
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2006/10/11, 12:16 PM
Any time a person has to tell you how many letters they have after their name is trying to say, hey I am smart. There has been tons, and I mean literally tons of nutritionists from the top schools in the country that used to preach you only need 60 gr. of protein, or bodybuilders/strength athletes need no more than the joe couch potato. Over the years they have backed off their stance, finding out that what bodybuilders experience catabolism on an almost daily basis. Apparantely there are still a few out there. :)
Lets take a simple example...Joe blow in this corner is a 150lb. bodybuilder. Bill Smith in this corner is a 250 lb. bodybuilder. The question prevails, can both of these guys only utilize 20-25 gr. of protein?
And what about the type of protein....a faster acting protein like whey, or a slower protein like casein that actually gels in the gut upon digestion. How about a blend. You think the body knows what time it is, and says in one hour, too much protein. Protein digestion rates varies. Most eat mixed meals...this skews things even further.
And on the subject of Muscular glycogen synthesis...it is rate limited in the muscle, getting stuff in a little bit quicker makes not one shred of difference for the most part. Remember, as muscles or liver fill with glycogen, they become resistant to uptake. The cell becomes insulin resistance, glut4 translocation decreases, forcing carbs to go elsewhere for processing. Glycogen repletion is not the only reason to spike insulin/blood amino acid levels post workout. So, while carbs are 'protein sparing', there is limitations.
For instance, once you uptake carbs beyond a certain amount, more doesn't make any diference because you are now limited by digestion, blood glucose uptake, etc.
It is generally believed it is good to have high glycemic carbs pwo, but the number one reason is you still want to try to raise insulin for other reasons i.e...turning off catabolism as insulin is directly anti-catabolic to protein synthesis..
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Maximus from Gladiator....Strength and Honor!
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2006/10/11, 12:20 PM
Message deleted by moderator due to unsuitable content for this board.
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2006/10/11, 12:24 PM
What that means is that you need PROTEIN and a good amount of it to build muscles, and that while carbs are good for ya they do not REPAIR muscle Tissue!
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A journey beigns with a single step.
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/10/11, 04:36 PM
Mutt look back at my posts and show me where I said "simply carbs repair muscle." I said high glycemic carbs help to speed recovery after a workout. I know protein repairs muscle! Nowhere in my post did I ever say that it did not. You guys keep saying that I said protein doesn't repair muscle but read all of my posts and you will see I never once said that. All of the arguing completely destroyed the topic of the post. Read the first post again! Once again I post something and it gets completely turned around and upside down. The topic of the post is DEAD now! Thanks for the schooling. I learned nothing. I will definitely agree with bb1fit though that everyones bodies are different and I will be a man about it and say that there probably isn't an exact number of grams of protein that everyones body can synthesize in one sitting. There is a good chance that statement is false. It really does make more sense that a larger man would need more. But that statement does come from some very reputable doctors and nutritionists but even they have plenty of room for error. Oh and Jeramie all foods don't have more carbs than protein: What about the entire MEAT group?
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2006/10/11, 04:38 PM
Carbs repair muscles and give you the energy to do the workouts.
right in the middle:big_smile:
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A journey beigns with a single step.
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/10/11, 04:40 PM
Here is the entire post:
Well I tend to think that doctors and nutritionists know a little more than bodybuilders. Maybe it's the years of study and research. I don't think that getting this huge amount of protein is going to make the difference that people are led to believe it will. Most of the workouts and tips in these bodybuilding mags and things like that are for people on steroids. Most people don't realize that carbs are a lot more important than protein. And the majority of protein powders have little to no carbs. :love:Carbs repair muscles and give you the energy to do the workouts. If your lacking carbs the body will break down muscle to use as its energy source.:love: Protein is great but it is getting way too much praise and carbs get left in the shadows. There are no supplements (even protein shakes) that are worth the money. You can get the same things out of foods. And the reason I posted this is because I was one of those guys trying to find this miracle supplement that was going to get me big and it was all just wishful thinking. Genes play a big role in the amount of muscle you can build as well as your lifestyle but supplements aren't going to change your genetic structure and they aren't going to make up your mind for you to start working out. I'm just trying to relay a message so somebody else doesn't go out and spend all of this money for nothing (like I did unfortunately) but it became more of an argument than a message and that was not my intention
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A journey beigns with a single step.
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2006/10/11, 04:45 PM
now now gentlemen...can't we all just ...be friends...
all fouts was trying to say in the beggining is everyone should drop all these ideals about using supplements to get a desired effect...no fat burners,and weight gainer,and ripped muscle fuel and ephedra and caffiene...just good old food and some nice heavy weights on the bar to get where you want to be...which is what most of you believe also...
man...the testosterone is riding high in here...
I wouldn't try to out do bb1 anymore fouts....he is a WHOLE lot more than just a "bodybuilder"...just a little advice..take it or leave it...your choice.
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